Artwork

Ineffably magnificent…

If you want to actually realize the amount of possible misunderstanding in the current conversation and of what shell scriting is, please do consider joining #bash at Libera IRC. Please do also mention the word “throwaway” in the rooms! Since there’s literally no understanding on what you mean still, sorry. It does not feel like you have a significant enough understanding of the subjects raised.

For a very simple example, there are literally no documentation regarding certain cases you’ll encounter in Bash’s built-ins even, unless you actually encounter it or learn from Bash’s very source code, like read built-in. Not to mention shenanigans in shell logics for inter-process communication (IPC), file-descriptors, environment variables like PWD, exported functions’ BASH_FUNC_, pipes, etc.

I still don’t get what you mean, sorry. And why Bash and not another shell?
Why not Korn, Ash, Dash, Zsh, Fish, or anything REPL, including PHP, Perl, Node, Python etc.

Should we consider “throwaway” anything that supports interactive mode of your daily driver you chose in your default terminal prompt?
What does “throwaway” code means in the first place?

I am sorry, but I am not sure what tells you how Bash “was designed” or not. Perhaps you haven’t yet written anything serious in Bash…
Have you checked out Bash PitFalls at Wooledge, at least?
Bash, or the most shells, including Posix, or even Perl, are some of the most complex languages out there to make a mistake… since there’s no compiler to protect you from, and though legendary but readline may cause the whole terminal go flying, depending on the terminal/terminfo in process…

No, sorry. I absolutely disagree on your stance regarding “shell” for a “bugless” “huge deal” in “real cases”.

There are some… of course, but for some reason these are first I recalled at this moment - some bands a military colleague had been listening back in the days, on fields.

The band name is Lyube (Любэ). There’s a YouTube channel, and some of the titles I still recall he listened to:
- А зори здесь тихие-тихие - Любэ;
- Там за туманами - Любэ;
- Комбат- Любэ;

Another song another colleague had been listening to was Чей чай горячей by Чайф.

And though I am not very fluent in Russian (the sense of lyrics in these are quite hard to comprehend, too), rare but tears of these two strong men made me believe these were incredibly significant for them, and represented an unbearable sorrow of any war…

It’s rather sad when such extensions don’t refer to their source code in descriptions.
Meanwhile, Google Chrome extensions are to be updated automatically.
Sorry, I won’t install it, since I have no trust in the source of it, and I care about my time to not re-check it on every update.

No, thank you. Sorry, never.

Not only that, but the huge probability of mistakes is just deafening. The last time I used LLM was in 2023 someone recommended for a task at paper work, and I got a literal headache in 10 minutes… Since then I never ever will use that sorrow for anything that is not for blackbox pentesting or experimental unverified data generated you may find in medicine or military isolated solutions.

That deafening feel that every single bit of output from that LLM or void machine may contain a mistake no soul is accountable for to ask about… A generated bit of someone’s work you just cannot verify since no source nor human is available… How would you trace the rationale that resulted in the output shown?

Faster? Is that so… Doesn’t verification of every output require even more time to test it and consider stable, to prove it is correct, to stay accountable for the knowledge and actions you perform as a developer, artist, researcher… human?

Your mind is to be trained to do a research, remember, and do not depend on someone’s service to a level of predominance/replacement.
Meanwhile, effort, passion, creativity, empathy, and love, in turn, you carry, supports in long-term.

You may not care now, though, but you do you. It’s your mind and memory you develop.

Thank you! You do you.

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“Self-hosted mind atrophy with skills degradation running in parallel.”
No. Absolutely no. You should code with your mind, and stay creative.

Related: Using AI Generated Code Will Make You a Bad Programmer

Thank you, but I do disagree. You cannot know the “result” of that LLM does include all the required context, and you won’t re-clarify it, since the output does already not contain the relevant, and in the end you miss the knowledge and waste the time, too.

How are you sure the output does include the relevant? Will you ever re-submit the question to an algorithm, without even knowing it is required re-submit it, since there’s even no indication for it? I.e. The LLM just did not include what you needed, did not include also important context surrounding it, and did not even tell you the authors to question further - no attribution, no accountability, no sense, sorry.

Please no. Absolutely not. LLM is absolutely not “nice for dealing with confusion” but the very opposite.
Please do consider people effort, articles, attributions, and actually learning and organizing your knowledge. Please do train your mind, and self-confidence.

Have you checked out the following issue case:

- FYI, I spun up an instance of 4get since I needed an alternative. It has worked flawlessly with all included search engine sources, including Google.
- Thanks, 4get is also good…
- I was using it for the last couple of days and I didn’t get any captcha.
Source

Hosting your own is optional.

SearXNG can be added to your browser’s search bar; moreover, it can be set as the default search engine.
Source

-–

This website shows the SearXNG public instances. It is updated every 24 hours, except the response times which are updated every 3 hours…
Public instances listed here may yield less accurate results as they have much higher traffic and consequently have a higher chance of being blocked by search providers such as Google, Qwant, Bing, Startpage, etc. Hosting your own instance or using an instance that isn’t listed here may give you a more consistent search experience.
Source

Wonderful day! Have you checked out metasearch engines like the following?: SearXNG (…is a free internet metasearch engine which aggregates results from various search services and databases. Users are neither tracked nor profiled…)

SearXNG is a fork of the well-known searx metasearch engine which was inspired by the Seeks project. It provides basic privacy by mixing your queries with searches on other platforms without storing search data.
Source

Thank you, but I am sorry, I will not read the output of the LLM. I’ll re-recheck the grammar manually.

It’s worth to mention that the StackOverflow survey referenced does not include many countries with also great/genius developers, including Belarus, Russia, China, Iran…
There are related cases raised on Meta scopes: Developer Survey 2025 is, apparently, region blocked…

Apparently, while I’ve being employed in security as software engineer for at least 19 years now, I’ve never ever considered these trendy LLM/“AI” all serious, and still do not.

Sorry, I have literally no interest in all of it that makes you dependent on it, atrophies mind, degrades research and social skills, and negates self-confidencen with respect to other authors, their work, and attributions. Nor any of my colleagues in military and those I know better in person.

Constant research, general IDEs like JetBrains’s, IDA Pro, Sublime Text, VS Code, etc. backed by forums, chats, and Communities, is absolutely enough for the accountable and fun work in our teams, who manage to keep in adequate deadlines.

Nor will use any LLM in my work, art, or research… I prefer people, communication, discoveries, effort, creativity, and human art…
I just disable it everywhere possible, and will do all my life. The close case to my environment was VS Code, and hopefully there’s no reason to build it from source since they still leave built-in options to disable it: https://stackoverflow.com/a/79534407/5113030 (How can I disable GitHub Copilot in VS Code?..)

Isn’t it just inadequate to not think and develop your mind, and let alone pass control of your environment to a yet another model or “advanced T9” of unknown source of unknown iteration.

In pentesting, random black-box IO, medicine experimental unverified intel, log data approximation why not? But in environment control, education, art or programming, fine art… No, never ^^

Meanwhile… so freaking, incredibly many developers, artists are left without attribution, respect, gratitude…
So many people atrophy their skils for learning, contribution, researching, accumulation, self-organization…
So much human precious time is wasted…
So much gets devalued…

The time will show… and just a few actually accountable will recover only, probably…
This is so heartache… sorrowful…

Thank you…

Apparently, I’ve never ever considered any LLM serious, convenient, appropriate, similar to Markov’s chain, though those differ, and I disable and uninstall absolutely everything that is LLM related, or alters human effortful works, including programming suggestions, searching, and in any kind of adequate research, in the personal life or everywhere possible since 2021 (and some in 2023), where I had a few months of experimenting with those - enough to consider the time I still have to continue actually learning, discovering, and staying social as much as I can…

Please… Please, in context of such education… instead of investing your priceless, precious, finite life time… into such empty void as unknown output of unknown LLM from unknown dataset of unknown artists… developers… people… Please, instead, please consider to take your time… and try to see the love in someone’s else works, courses, videos, books, articles, schemes, tables, drawings… who would be only heartfelt delighted to know… to know that someone else like you, like themselves… were reaching out for their experience they were gaining for decades and worked hard to prepare it for someone out there… in search… for someone who wishes and tries to create something, to improve the world… to reach for an achievement… to treasure a goal… to invent a miracle…

Since isn’t the following the miraculous purpose to live and contribute to the infinite world? To gain experience by confident, adequate effort, to work towards achievements, to stay responsible as a human, to stay alive… Which is at least: personal contributions published, social interactions, actually felt and considered facts organized by accountable people, self-confidence and miraculous time you invest into learning the human experience published in marvelous works of books, articles, videos, forums, chats - the ineffable magnificence…

There’s use for LLM, including pentesting, medicine and analyzing of unknown and random for the sake of random in scopes of “black-box”, for example, sure, but overly rarely and the fear of malformed facts, unknown sources, disturbed art… will always shadow any presence of such generative technologies, I believe… Yet, shouldn’t technology support you, your mind (i.e. not atrophy it but train and discipline it), your creativity, your ideas, your… existence?

Since isn’t learning from someone else experience is actually important… Isn’t it ineffably magnificent to discover someone’s hard work… Isn’t the process of learning and discovering actually fun!
Isn’t the knowledge that you unique carry valuable… What is the fun, the purpose, otherwise…?

Please consider your confidence, skills, mind, and… your precious time…

“If you’re not paying for the product, then you are the product.” ~ Tristan Harris
“Machines should work; people should think.” ~ IBM Pollyanna Principle